My fell 9 days ago in the bathroom and broke her neck. She's 87 years old. She was living with me at the time. She's been in the hospital since but hasn't eaten in over 8 days now and they can't get her meds into her. They stopped her IV meds and want her to take meds by mouth. She is refusing and is completely confused, scared and just plain not there anymore. I guess they call it hospital psychosis. Today, the docs want to talk to me about alternative solutions for her meaning feeding tube I guess. She is a DNR and I am absolutely sure about her wishes. She would never want to live this way at all and has stated many times before this that she was ready to meet God. She is not paralyzed from the fall. Has a neck brace on as surgery was out of the question. They have her hand tied in mittens cause she was pulling off the neck brace. She's become a very difficult woman now and is actually not very nice. I adore my mom so please know this before I ask this next question. I'm an only child so I have no other people to really ask. Should I allow the feeding tube so she doesn't starve to death and gets her meds or should I do what she has asked me to do and allow her to eventually "go to God"? Even writing that sounds like I'm a horrible person. I'm really lost here so any help would be appreciated.
It may help to think of the question as being about deciding if my loved should live or die AT THIS TIME. Ultimately (short of homicide) we do not have the power over life and death. Someone with a fatal condition is going to die of it, pretty much regardless of what we do. Giving certain drugs or treatments, putting in a feeding tube, etc. is not going to prevent someone from dying ... but it might postpone the event. For how long? At what quality of life? Those are the questions to ponder and get professional input about.
Yes, she's in pain and confused. And yes, she has a DNR. And double yes, you are a good person. The fact that you are agonizing about this is proof.
I'm glad you are alert to the long-term consequences of feeding-tubes and other invasive treatments. One of the things I found helpful was getting the doctors to write a "condition of use" addition to the order for the procedure.
My husband was on a feeding-tube for two weeks. At the end of that time, the tube was removed and he recovered well enough to eat on his own. If that doesn't seem to be happening for your mom, its time for another conversation with her doctor about quality of life. You need to ask:
1. Who is benefiting from the tube (the institution's death statistics, the
doctor's death statistics, the person on the tube, or your own guilty conscience?
2. Does the end justify the means? Is someone learning from this experience? Is there something about her condition that makes this situation unique?
3. What is your own highest principle? Life at all costs? Everyone getting along? The greatest good for the greatest number? Only when you know that can you make a sound reasoned decision.
Whatever you decide, someone is going to be unhappy -- doctors, aunts and uncles, her friends, your friends, the list goes on. Get the hospital's ethics chairman to walk you through the choices. Then take a deep breath and do whatever the two of you descide and know that you did your best. Hold your head up high and stick out your tongue at anyone who criticizes you.
this in not in malice, but i wish for him a peaceful exit.
he is not the man he once was. who is. he knows his time is near.
You pretty much have already answered your question by stating this to us that, "She would never want to live this way at all and has stated many times before this that she was ready to meet God."
I know this has to be very hard on you but you already know what her wishes are for situation like this one. You are in our prayers and we all support you on your final decision.
Subsequently, dad was place in hospice. 2 yrs later, Dad is still in NH care with mom, he is eating and drinking…what and when he wants to! In other words, I have no regrets for going the xtra mile, but in reality was I right to go against the DNR? I don’t know and I don’t judge anyone in this position.
I can only tell you that thru many nights of crying and praying and listening to my inner voice, I made a decision that I could live with.
This community has been a support group for me when family and friends just didn’t get it…the loving and caring people out here GOT it and held my mouse as I typed out my fears and tears.
Seek and you will find the answers, love, support and guidance that you need. May your way be made clear, you are a loving and caring person making tough decisions.
Love and blessings!
Finally, a very caring nurse sat down with me and asked me if I would want to go through all of this, knowing that the prognosis was not good. She explained that even though my mom probably wasn't totally aware of what was going on, she still was being put through hell. She asked me to look at what quality of life I expected my mother to have if she were to get through this. I had my answer at that point. The last couple days, they had to insert a feeding tube...so many tubes and cords sticking out of her neck. After almost 2 weeks of constant pain and agony, I signed the DNR for her...she passed the next day.
I understand what you are saying being an only child...I have a brother, but he lives far away, and I had to make all the decisions on my own.
I feel so much empathy for you...I grew up a lot during all this.
I would insert the feeding tube, and add a heated I V. Make sure she is comfortable at all times. She will pass anyway and probably soon. If you do all these things, you will have no regrets. God Bless you and good luck!
I was in your shoes one and one half years ago. I still am in your shoes, since I did agree to put a gastric feeding tube in mom when she suddenly stopped eating, taking meds one and one half years ago due to dementia. She was 84, now this April she will be 86. I have full time care for her in her own home, with caring home
attendants that I hand picked. Mom never told me what she wanted to do if she were in that situation. I couldn't live with not feeding a disabled person, and especially when she made me her health care proxy, it was my responsibility to do what is best for Mom. That is the million dollar question. Well, initially I regretted the decision, she wasn't happy, but then after a few months, she adapted to everything, all the while being in her own home, her own bed, and I visited and orchestrated all the details . I have had opportunities to talk to mom, she has kissed me and is so happy to still see me and my children, Her ability to speak has diminished, but we get her out of bed each day, she gets wheeled into her living room and looks out the window. She has gone to church, has gone to her first grandchilds wedding, she knows that she is still loved. She is TOTALLY dependent on her caregiver for food, mediicine and water. Was this worth it? I don't know. The feeding tube will wear down, In order to change it, the doc would have to pull it out which I am sure will hurt mom, only to replace it with a another. I will not do that, but I know that I will feel guilty then too, as I felt guilty about making the choice of her living or dying. You see, Dementia has been taking her, and is she can't eat or drink, then
maybe we need to accept that it is her time and we don't have the responsibility of saving her life, if her life is only supported artificially. So, I don't have an answer for you, but if your mom has already expressed her wishes to you, then I would respect her wishes. I didn't know my mom's wishes. Take her lead. Show her love, and let her take control of her life and death. I have had moments with my mom that I would never have had by artificially feeding her. But, I 've just allowed her to be in a compromising life situation, in the best possible living environments, her home. Who was the feeding tube really for? To alleviate my guilt and responsibility to save her? Was her medical condition going to get better? No. So, try and come to terms with the idea that mom is going to die. Take a look at how that feels for you. The feeding tube could extend your mom's life for a few years. What kind of years will they be and would she want to live in a compromised situation, totally relying on someone else for survival.
I send you blessings and courage. Any day and any phone call I will be facing again this situation, but I think, I am more inclined to let her go now. May God Bless.
Helen
I was in your shoes one and one half years ago. I still am in your shoes, since I did agree to put a gastric feeding tube in mom when she suddenly stopped eating, taking meds one and one half years ago due to dementia. She was 84, now this April she will be 86. I have full time care for her in her own home, with caring home
attendants that I hand picked. Mom never told me what she wanted to do if she were in that situation. I couldn't live with not feeding a disabled person, and especially when she made me her health care proxy, it was my responsibility to do what is best for Mom. That is the million dollar question. Well, initially I regretted the decision, she wasn't happy, but then after a few months, she adapted to everything, all the while being in her own home, her own bed, and I visited and orchestrated all the details . I have had opportunities to talk to mom, she has kissed me and is so happy to still see me and my children, Her ability to speak has diminished, but we get her out of bed each day, she gets wheeled into her living room and looks out the window. She has gone to church, has gone to her first grandchilds wedding, she knows that she is still loved. She is TOTALLY dependent on her caregiver for food, mediicine and water. Was this worth it? I don't know. The feeding tube will wear down, In order to change it, the doc would have to pull it out which I am sure will hurt mom, only to replace it with a another. I will not do that, but I know that I will feel guilty then too, as I felt guilty about making the choice of her living or dying. You see, Dementia has been taking her, and is she can't eat or drink, then
maybe we need to accept that it is her time and we don't have the responsibility of saving her life, if her life is only supported artificially. So, I don't have an answer for you, but if your mom has already expressed her wishes to you, then I would respect her wishes. I didn't know my mom's wishes. Take her lead. Show her love, and let her take control of her life and death. I have had moments with my mom that I would never have had by artificially feeding her. But, I 've just allowed her to be in a compromising life situation, in the best possible living environments, her home. Who was the feeding tube really for? To alleviate my guilt and responsibility to save her? Was her medical condition going to get better? No. So, try and come to terms with the idea that mom is going to die. Take a look at how that feels for you. The feeding tube could extend your mom's life for a few years. What kind of years will they be and would she want to live in a compromised situation, totally relying on someone else for survival.
I send you blessings and courage. Any day and any phone call I will be facing again this situation, but I think, I am more inclined to let her go now. May God Bless.
Helen
"There is a difference between being alive and living."
You know what should be done...what your mother would want. You're feeling guilty coming to that conclusion or saying it. You are not a horrible person for thinking this way. Your conscience is speaking to you.
I wish you, and your mother, peace.
hugs to you.....
At first, I was so guilt filled, and angry. I hated the doctor, because, he said that she would live, if they removed her leg. I had to finally come to the realization that she would have died either way. And, that I did what I thought was best at the time. It is the saddest think in life, when we have to make those kinds of decisions. I thought back to the kind of woman my mom was. She would not want to live sick, being the kind of person that she was.
Above all, know that you are not selfish or anything other, than trying to make the best decision that you can make. And, that is all that you can do. I wish you peace.
I think of my own father, who spent his last two years laying in a bed in a nursing facility - slowly dying from a brain tumor. He could still eat, but had an IV for fluids and he lingered and lingered. The final year he was unable to talk. I know in my heart that he would have preferred death, but death didn't come easily for daddy.
He was always so active. A cowboy in his younger days. He was an avid gardener and outdoor person - had hobbies (he was a Rock Hound and made lovely jewelry) and loved to play with his grandkids. We didn't use any heroic efforts to prolong his life - he just lived - far longer than he wanted to. We would never have done anything to hasten his passing, but certainly did nothing to help him linger either. There is nothing easy about watching someone we love so much die. It is so very hard to say goodbye.
I lived in another city. I remember the last night I spent with my dad. I talked to him and held his hand and his eyes told me he loved me. I sat on the floor next to his bed for a very long time while he slept. Before I left - I told him good bye and told him he didn't have to hang on for me - to rest if he needed to. Then I went home. I got the call early the next morning that he was gone.
I have never stopped missing him. It has been forty years and it's like it all happened yesterday. I still have flowers from his yard and a night blooming Cerius cactus he gave me when I got married 44 years ago. Wish he were here to see them.
my mom and dad went through these same things. the only reason they went through rehab was because they wanted to please me. my mother passed away 1 yrs ago and my dad is slipping away day by day. i just want my dad to be comfortable, safe and cared for, for as long as he can.