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I. How We Work in Washington. Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services. APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
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III. When We Tour. APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
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V. Complaints. Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights. APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.I agree that: A.I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information"). B.APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink. C.APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site. D.If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records. E.This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year. F.You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
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You have to get rid of his car. If he thinks the car is accessible and HIS keys are accessible, he’ll obsess about finding them.
If not SAFE, what he WANTS cannot be allowed, no matter how badly he wants it. This is the unfortunate and painful responsibility of caring for an aging LO whose condition has begun to deteriorate
Get the car out of his sight. Sell it or give it away or seclude it somewhere. However much he complains, it is really much kinder than allowing him to hurt himself or someone else, or worse.
I have to ask (since you provide very little info): why should he not be driving? Was he having accidents? Getting lost in familiar routes? Road-raging? I'm only inquiring because my mother is 92 and has been a "normal" driver - she self-limits so that she chooses to not drive at night, during rush hour, or in bad weather and only to a few very familiar places that are not far. I have secretly driver a few cars behind her to see how she is faring.
If your father is a proven dangerous driver, and you've stated he will go to the dealer to get new keys - don't take him and make sure other neighbors, friends and family are given a scripted excuse by you why they can't take him either. You do need to physically remove the car from his sight (therapeutic fib: "I drove it and the check engine light came on - it's in the shop and will take a long time to repair" and then give him a fictional name of a shop if he asks.)
The go onto his state's DMV website where you can anonymously report him as a dangerous driver. The state will send him a snail mail letter informing him that he is required to come in to take a certain test (in some states it's an eye test, in other states it may be different). Then again, make sure NO ONE takes him to this appointment. His license will expire or be revoked. He still may insist on driving so DO NOT return the car.
If you are his financial PoA then sell it and cancel the insurance. Then make sure he cannot go to a dealership and buy another vehicle. There was a poster on this forum who's father did just this. FYI there is no way for a dealership to be the judge of whether someone "should" be buy a vehicle. To deny someone would get them in legal trouble.
All of this will aggitate your father, so be prepared to substitute his rides so that he still is getting out and about. Discreetly "hire" friends, neighbors and family to offer him rides to places and appointments. I did this for my LO and gave the volunteers gift cards to restaurants so that they'd also take my LO out to lunch or dinner after the errand. She loved it and barely complained about no longer driving. Don't make ending his driving privilege contensious -- you will both be miserable. Plan in advance and hopefully it can go as "good" as possible.
Choosing not to sell to someone is not illegal if it isn't because someone is part of a protected class (race, gender, etc.). A dealership has every right to refuse service to anyone.
That said, if Dad's the type to always buy from a particular dealership, it wouldn't be a bad idea to alert that dealer's general manager and sales manager not to sell to him.
Tell him honestly he can't drive anymore. Unfortunately, this is the one vestige of independence many elderly people try to hold onto and it is the one that holding onto impacts the welfare of others.
Do not give in! My best friend's mother insisted on driving until she hit another car and caused a pregnant woman to give birth prematurely to an infant who died two days later.
Oh, how awful. This is a great reminder of how important it is that people of impaired judgment and reflexes NOT be allowed to drive. The consequences can be nightmarish.
GoBeavs, oh how older folks, and even teen-agers, who shouldn't be driving, still insist they can drive. Lot of it is ego driven.
We have to remember that when we take something away from a senior, that we need to replace it with something else. I know it can be a challenge. Not all of us grown children are available to be their driver. Some parents will refuse taxi or County senior bus service. And some parents won't listen to reason.
If you wind up being the driver, set boundaries. Oh how I wished I did. My parents had passed years ago, but to this day I can't drive more than a couple miles from my house due to long lasting panic attacks that I had developed driving my parents around, and the stress of trying to get time off from work to do so.
Actually, don't you have to have a key to get a new one. I know the cars we did have a key for had a number on it to be able to get a duplicate.
Oh yes, the stories told on this forum where the cars were disabled but the parent called the garage to get it fixed. Or a neighbor or family member took them to get a new key. You need to get rid of the car. Out of sight out of mind. Call the dealership and tell them in no way Dad is allowed another set of keys. DMV has revolked his privileges. They can't remember things from day to day but they know how to get around being told they can't drive and finding away to do it.
Have his doctor inform DMV or you do it. Once revoked it will be in the system. If somehow he drives, you can call the police to pull him over and explain why he can't be driving.
I always answer directly, even when I know it's not what they want to hear. If it gets confrontational, I think I might request a police officer to come and explain why people lose their licenses. Attitudes usually improve when strangers come into the picture.
My parents sold me their sweet ride when they moved in with us as they could no longer drive. Dad had a short spell of wanting to drive,, didn;t remember it was mine and he could no longer drive. We told him the keyfob stopped working,, it was ordered, then lost in the mail, then backordered.. what ever it took. One day he went out to the garage 25 times to check the car.. and come back in to see if it was his! Luck for us it was short lived
Tell his doctor he is still driving. In many states they are mandatory reporters. We couldn't get our LO to give up driving until the license was revoked by her doctor reporting her to the state. She had fibbed to the point he thought she had given up driving and was surprised when the family told him different. He immediately filed the paperwork and the state did the deed for us. We then had what we needed to cancel the insurance. Once that was done, our LO capitulated on getting rid of the car. But beware! While it solved the driving issue, she started wandering (trying to walk everywhere). With that said, at least she won't be hurting or killing someone else. Our family would rather have our LO mad and upset losing driving privileges then ever live with hurting someone innocent.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
If not SAFE, what he WANTS cannot be allowed, no matter how badly he wants it. This is the unfortunate and painful responsibility of caring for an aging LO whose condition has begun to deteriorate
Get the car out of his sight. Sell it or give it away or seclude it somewhere. However much he complains, it is really much kinder than allowing him to hurt himself or someone else, or worse.
If your father is a proven dangerous driver, and you've stated he will go to the dealer to get new keys - don't take him and make sure other neighbors, friends and family are given a scripted excuse by you why they can't take him either. You do need to physically remove the car from his sight (therapeutic fib: "I drove it and the check engine light came on - it's in the shop and will take a long time to repair" and then give him a fictional name of a shop if he asks.)
The go onto his state's DMV website where you can anonymously report him as a dangerous driver. The state will send him a snail mail letter informing him that he is required to come in to take a certain test (in some states it's an eye test, in other states it may be different). Then again, make sure NO ONE takes him to this appointment. His license will expire or be revoked. He still may insist on driving so DO NOT return the car.
If you are his financial PoA then sell it and cancel the insurance. Then make sure he cannot go to a dealership and buy another vehicle. There was a poster on this forum who's father did just this. FYI there is no way for a dealership to be the judge of whether someone "should" be buy a vehicle. To deny someone would get them in legal trouble.
All of this will aggitate your father, so be prepared to substitute his rides so that he still is getting out and about. Discreetly "hire" friends, neighbors and family to offer him rides to places and appointments. I did this for my LO and gave the volunteers gift cards to restaurants so that they'd also take my LO out to lunch or dinner after the errand. She loved it and barely complained about no longer driving. Don't make ending his driving privilege contensious -- you will both be miserable. Plan in advance and hopefully it can go as "good" as possible.
That said, if Dad's the type to always buy from a particular dealership, it wouldn't be a bad idea to alert that dealer's general manager and sales manager not to sell to him.
Do not give in! My best friend's mother insisted on driving until she hit another car and caused a pregnant woman to give birth prematurely to an infant who died two days later.
We have to remember that when we take something away from a senior, that we need to replace it with something else. I know it can be a challenge. Not all of us grown children are available to be their driver. Some parents will refuse taxi or County senior bus service. And some parents won't listen to reason.
If you wind up being the driver, set boundaries. Oh how I wished I did. My parents had passed years ago, but to this day I can't drive more than a couple miles from my house due to long lasting panic attacks that I had developed driving my parents around, and the stress of trying to get time off from work to do so.
Oh yes, the stories told on this forum where the cars were disabled but the parent called the garage to get it fixed. Or a neighbor or family member took them to get a new key. You need to get rid of the car. Out of sight out of mind. Call the dealership and tell them in no way Dad is allowed another set of keys. DMV has revolked his privileges. They can't remember things from day to day but they know how to get around being told they can't drive and finding away to do it.
Have his doctor inform DMV or you do it. Once revoked it will be in the system. If somehow he drives, you can call the police to pull him over and explain why he can't be driving.
Good Luck.
If has dementia or other issues with reason, leave out any explaining & distract distract distract.